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Category: Retro computing

Running Windows 1.01 and old versions of DOS

Running Windows 1.01 and old versions of DOS

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I learned to program back on an old TRS-80 Model III computer as a kid. Long before Windows and even DOS, most home computers required you type in programs or load them from cassette tapes. If you were really rich, you might afford a floppy drive, but that was an expensive luxury I never had. My next computer was an IBM XT, and it ran the advanced and stalwart DOS 3.30 – which was dramatically better.

Running those old operating systems today requires you either buy one of those old systems and keep it running, or you have to emulate them. You can easily emulate DOS 3.3 and Windows 3.0 and higher on VMWare or Virtualbox, but going earlier than doesn’t seem to be supported anymore.

Enter 86Box – an emulator that lets you emulate REALLY old machines. In fact, I was able to get Dos 3.2 running Windows 1.0.

Here’s what you’ll need:

Part 1 – 86Box Setup

  1. Download 86Box and install it (source is on github).
  2. Download the latest romset and put it in the directory for 86Box called roms\
  3. Download DOS 3.2 image disks here.
  4. Download Windows 1.01 image disks here.
  5. [For later fun: download any of the other amazing images on the parent page]
  6. Start 86Box and set up 86Box by selecting Tools->Settings from the top menu, and set the system up with the following settings.

Part 2: DOS 3.2 and Windows 1.01 install

  1. Start up the 86Box.
  2. Set Media->Floppy 1 to disk01.img, then issue a ‘CTRL-ALT-DEL’ to reset it. The system should start up and boot to the dos 3.20 floppy drive
  1. Run ‘fdisk’ and it should detect your hard drive. You’ll need to create a partition to set up the hard drive.
  1. Reboot and boot from the DOS 3.20 disk again.
  2. Format the hard drive by using ‘format c: /s’
  3. Set Media->Floppy 1 to ‘DISK1-SETUP.IMG’ from the Windows 1.01 (5.25)
  4. [optional] type ‘set prompt=$p$g’ if you want to see your full path in the command prompt
  5. Run ‘setup’ from a: and follow the instructions to install Windows 1.01 on C:. Change the disks when prompted by selecting Media->Floppy 1 and setting it to each of the floppy disks for the Windows setup until it’s completed.
  6. type ‘C:’ to switch to the hard drive
  7. ‘cd \windows’
  8. ‘win’ to start windows
  9. Voila!
Attaching 5.25″ floppy drives via USB

Attaching 5.25″ floppy drives via USB

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Floppy disks are a relic of the past these days. You can still see the odd 3.5″ floppy – and there are even still companies making 3.5″ USB drives you can plug into your system today. But 5.25″ floppy drives (360k and 1.2 meg variety) are much more scarce. So scarce, in fact, that you’re likely not to find any outside of an old vintage computer. Most modern PC’s since the Pentium don’t even have connectors, interfaces that support them, and I know of no vendors that make USB 5.25″ drives. Even worse, it appears starting in Windows 10, the floppy drivers were removed from the OS.

So what is one to do if they have old 5.25″ floppies they need to read? Turns out others have had the same problem – so you’re not alone.

Here’s some options:

  1. Find a service that will convert them – Usually for a fee around $5-$25 per disk.
  2. Buy an vintage computer from eBay that has a working 5.25″ drive.
    For PC’s, this means a 486 or lower computer. Almost all plug-in floppy controllers require a PC who’s motherboard has an ISA interface (not PCI). You must be careful because older 8-bit ISA floppy controllers (from the XT/AT era) often will NOT work in faster 386/486/Pentium ISA interfaces (even though they are supposed too and early 486 motherboards let you slow down the ISA interface clocks in BIOS). Vintage Apple, Commodore 64, and other computers can be found on local sales forums, ebay, garage sales, and swap meets. You can then potentially copy the data off and transfer to a modern computer using a network or a serial port transfer cable.
  3. Use a flux-style reader. These allow you to attach a 5.25″ drive to a controller board which then connects to your USB port. The big limitation is that you cannot interact with the disks via DOS or command line options. Instead, you need to read/write whole disk images or operate at the sector level. These readers do this by reading flux data. While this is more complicated, it is the method that archivists are using to backup disks. Reading flux data gives you the ability to read/write disks from almost any platform and in any format – even copy protected disks.
    1. GreaseWeasle V4 [NEW 2022] – https://decromancer.ca/greaseweazle/
      Interfaces with 8″, 5 1/4″, and 3 1/2″ drives. Amazingly, it only costs $31 CAD and seems to get as good reviews as the Kryoflux. Definitely one of the cheapest options on this list. Since it extracts the raw flux transitions from the drive, any diskette format can be captured and analyzed – PC, Amiga, Amstrad, PDP-11, and just about any other computers as well as many older electronic musical instruments and industrial equipment floppies. They also include a wonderful array of disk reading/writing software utilities. The design is fully open and comes with no license encumberment.
      [UPDATE 10-2022] I bought one of these and could not be happier (lots of info here). It’s pretty sweet!
    2. SuperCard Pro – https://www.cbmstuff.com/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=52
      Seems like this is the new high-end champion. Not cheap at $99, but it gets regular firmware updates, can read an amazing array of flux data. Can be driven from a USB port or as a stand alone device. Supports duplicating disks that were written with the data starting and ending at the index pulse (the majority of all commercial programs were created this way). It also supports non-index copied disks and has an analyzer program that allows you to duplicate 100% of everything written on standard circular tracks, regardless of their relation to the index pulse.
    3. Kryoflux – https://www.kryoflux.com/
      Used to be the holy grail of floppy readers, but not cheap at 105€. It is able to read all formats, save as a raw stream, or export to common sector formats like the Acorn Electron, Apple, Amstrad CPC, Archimedes, Atari 8-bit, Atari ST, BBC, Commodore 64, Commodore Amiga, MSX, IBM PC, PC-8801, Sam Coupe, Spectrum, E-MU Emulator & Emulator II, DEC RX01 & RX02 and many others.
    4. Device Side Data’s FC5025 –http://www.deviceside.com/fc5025.html
      USB 5.25″ floppy controller plugs into any computer’s USB port and enables you to attach a 5.25″ floppy drive. Even if your computer has no built-in floppy controller, the FC5025 lets you read those old disks. It also understands formats used by Apple, Atari, Commodore, TI, and others.
    5. Supercard Pro – https://www.cbmstuff.com/
      I don’t know very much about this one, but here’s a review and this page which contains a lot of useful information.
    6. DREM – https://www.drem.info/
      DREM is a MFM/RLL hard drive emulator that can read raw dumps of a hard drive. It also allows you to read floppies. More here.
  4. ISA on modern PC’s

Cables/Adapters for connecting 3.5/5.25/8″ floppy drives to your PC:

Finding cables for your floppy drive can also be a pain. Here are some places you might look, but supplies and suppliers do come and go frequently.

  • CablesOnline – http://www.cablesonline.com/ also their (ebay store)
    CablesOnline has a good selection of universal floppy cables for a very reasonable price.
  • IEC.net also has a selection of floppy cables, and can custom-make floppy cables for you.
    • They also have MFM and RLL hard drive cables (and can make them to order)
  • Dbit – http://www.dbit.com/fdadap.html
    The DBit FDADAP board is a small adapter which adapts 8″ floppy disk drives (Shugart SA800 style bus) to work with the PC 3.5″/5.25″ floppy disk cable pinout. It has 34- and 50-pin connectors which can be connected to the PC floppy controller and the 8″ disk drive using simple straight-through ribbon cables (not included), and a 3.5″ style power connector for the on-board microcontroller
  • TexElec – https://texelec.com/product/8-inch-floppy-adapter/
    TexElec makes tons of retro computing dream boards (clone Adlib, IDE, floppy, and other controllers) as well as this 34 to 50 pin 8″ floppy drive adapter board that allows you to plug in 8″ floppy disk drives with a standard PC 3.5″/5.25″ floppy disk cable.

Dead/Discontinued controllers

  • Catweasel – http://www.nishtek.com/cw.html
    Discontinued PCI board for connecting to floppies. Like other solutions, it doesn’t make drives show up as a drive letter – but rather lets you read raw formats for all sorts of platforms.

Other resources/discussions: